Electronic Tolling (or is it Electronic Trolling?)

"ttyymmnn" (ttyymmnn) 09/10/2014 at 10:11 • Filed to: None

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I got a bill for going through the Elizabeth River Tunnels in Norfolk on our vacation last June. The toll for each passage was $0.75, but the processing fee is $1.50 — for each toll. Then they cheerfully add, "You would have saved $4.50 with an EZ Pass!" Way to stick it to the tourists. They should have said, "Thank you for visiting Norfolk! Fuck you!"

And what's even more hilarious is that the form they provide to pay the toll gives you the option of writing out your entire credit card number with expiration date or your bank account number with routing number. No electronic payment available. I wonder if they'll charge me more to process my check.

Alfalfa > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 10:15

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If they don't get no tolls, then they don't eat no rolls.

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 10:15

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Just fill out the form. Put it in a plain white, non-security envelope, and write on the outside "NO PERSONAL INFORMATION INSIDE". Totally legit.

ttyymmnn > AMGtech - now with more recalls! 09/10/2014 at 10:16

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I'm surprised they didn't ask for my SSN.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 10:17

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I just read an article that DC traffic authority openly brags about having better enforcement "than the IRS", the advantage given by people being "guilty until proven innocent", and freely admits that when a red-light or speeding cam catches multiple vehicles in frame they just pick one - "usually the one that's closer".

Given your cheery screwing and the incident with Travis in VA as well, I suspect the secret motto of any and all traffic enforcement east of the Alleghenies to be "abandon all hope, ye who enter here".

thebigbossyboss > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 10:20

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This is one thing British Columbia got right with it's electronic toll bridge. (The Golden Ears Bridge). Out of state exempt. Temporary tags exempt.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 10:21

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See I wouldn't care as much if they actually bothered to make and stay with a *standard* for electronic tolling.

Because as it exists, I would have to have three transponders and three separate accounts for the places I go most often:

1) Georgia PeachPass (Because I live there)
2) Illinois iPass/E-ZPass (Parents live there)
3) SunPass (Parents have a rental property in Florida, and we go there for Christmas)

But since none of these interoperate with each other, it becomes a cluster, and God help you if you use the toll roads, because either you have to pull over and wait for the one cash person to take the toll, or have 3+ transponders.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 09/10/2014 at 10:25

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I'd extend that to east of the Blue Ridge Mountains as well. NC and SC do like the cheerful screwing with you with traffic enforcement. Especially NC, who loves to have the state patrol sit on the state line on I-85 North.

"Welcome to NC! You're doing an alleged +15. Here's your welcome 90 day license suspension! Have a great stay!"

crabdip > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 09/10/2014 at 10:29

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DC is a f*cking show! Thankfully I know pretty much where all the cameras are on my commute through that retched district. I actually had a flash go off behind me the other day on a camera i knew was there and i was going under the speed limit so we'll see if I get something in the mail.

ttyymmnn > thebigbossyboss 09/10/2014 at 10:29

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I think that's absolutely fair, but since Norfolk is home to the biggest naval base in the world, not to mention countless other military installations in the Tidewater area, the number of out-of-state plates would be enormous.

thebigbossyboss > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 10:31

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Good point hadn't considered. The 407 here in Ontario will chase you down to the end of the earth for their tolls, but I have never been on it.

I think since the tolls for the Golden Ears Bridge (between $2-$4) for a passenger car are small and the number of out of state is relatively small, they just figured it would be easier this way. Also it costs about $20 per day to put your cars on temps, so doing that to avoid $8 in tolls is just bad math.

ttyymmnn > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 09/10/2014 at 10:38

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Can you imagine how difficult it would be for these states to get together on this? It took years for the different tolling systems in Texas to be able to talk to each other. At least now I can use my TxTag all over the state.

Here in Austin they built enormous toll plazas for the new toll roads then about 7 years after completion they removed every human from the booths. It's entirely electronic or pay-by-mail (with added processing fee, of course). This is the ginormous plaza they built near my house. The center three lanes are TxTag only. The outer lanes with attendant booths, eight in each direction, have two lanes open, both without attendant. If you didn't have to go through these lanes to exit they'd have closed the entire plaza, as they did on other sections of the tollway. It's an absolute boondoggle, and somebody ( Cintra , the Spanish road construction company) got fat stacks of cash to build something that they knew would be obsolete in a short time.

twochevrons > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 10:41

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I don't particularly like toll roads, but New Zealand's implementation of them is excellent – you just drive past a camera, it reads your license plate, and either sends a bill to the registered owner, or deducts money from a prepaid account (you can prepay online, or at pay stations at the toll road entrance).

I imagine that the huge variety of license plate formats, and the inclusion of printed images on license plates, makes it a less practical proposition in the US, but as toll-roads go, it's about as painless as it can be.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 10:45

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It all comes back to Not Invented Here. HCTRA, NTTA, etc, all have their own little fiefdoms in which they do not want to concede any power.

Hell, it took massive bitching for the NE states + OH/IN/IL to voluntarily settle on E-ZPass.

Now, of course, Congress has said there should be interoperability by 10/1/2016, but I'll bet dollars to donuts that this is completely ignored.

 > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 10:51

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Send them back a letter stating you are a freeman and can travel this country without having to pay capitalist fees. That will show them!

ttyymmnn >  09/10/2014 at 11:09

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Yeah, that'll go over well. Probably about as well as it did for this guy.

Little Black Coupe Turned Silver > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 09/10/2014 at 12:19

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iPass doesn't work on SunPass?

When I was down in FL the rental car counter cheerfully told me "Oh, you should have just brought your iPass along, it would have worked. But we can sell you a toll package for the low price of $20!"

Little Black Coupe Turned Silver > ttyymmnn 09/10/2014 at 12:24

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I have an iPass, and two cars. Both cars are registered to the account via license plate, so it's cool to drive them without the physical transponder if I forget to switch it between cars.

I also recently moved from IL to WI, so got new plates. Which I updated on my account.

Before the last IL charges had processed, which apparently takes at least two weeks.

I got hit with a $90 fine for the missed tolls (5, which should have been like $10 with an iPass) and the late fees. Luckily all I had to do was call a number and tell them my iPass account

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > Little Black Coupe Turned Silver 09/10/2014 at 12:45

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SunPass and NC Quick Pass share a technology, which isn't the Mark IV Industries standard (Active RFID) that main line E-ZPass/iPass uses. They use the passive RFID stickers as opposed to active transponders. (TxTag and PeachPass also use passive RFID stickers, but are not interoperable with Florida or each other)

NC has lane reading equipment that can pick up either the Mark IV Industries active transponder or the SunPass style stickers, so they can read both. (Details: http://tollroadsnews.com/news/north-car… )

Allegedly Florida will get around to adding the multi-readers, but as of now, I would need separate transponders for SunPass and iPass, at least according to the E-ZPass Group website.

http://www.e-zpassiag.com/about-e-zpass/…

Little Black Coupe Turned Silver > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 09/10/2014 at 13:01

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Interesting. I was just going off what the guy at the rental car place told me. I had no idea Florida even had tolls until I got there. I ended up just going with the "unlimited toll package" they sold me, since I did end up needed it. There are few things I hate more than dealing with paying cash at tolls. I just wanted to get to Sebring in time for night practice for the 12 Hour.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > Little Black Coupe Turned Silver 09/10/2014 at 13:03

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If Georgia ever becomes interoperable with Florida, with the passive sticker tags, then it should theoretically be possible to buy an NC Quick Pass, and interoperate with the Peach Pass.

Then I'd only need one transponder.